Contrasting Candidates: Harrison and Kieschnick in The Lutheran Witness

Thanks to Scott Diekmann over on Stand Firm for finding this Q/A report on the presidential nominees from the Lutheran Witness. BJS commentors have asked for this, so I wanted to republish it here.

The statements that really strike me are:

The change we really need is not structural. We lack repentance. (Just look at how we treat one another [Gal. 5:16ff].) And we do not believe that the Word of God can actually unite us (Eph. 3:20).

Part of me might like the massive increase in power proposed for the Synod President. That’s why it’s not a good idea.

The major cause, I believe, is that we have virtually ceased funding what congregations care most about

 

From Stand Firm:


The June/July issue of The Lutheran Witness asks a series of questions to the five men whose names will appear on the ballot for President of the Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod in July, Rev. Matthew C. Harrison, Executive Director of LCMS World Relief and Human Care, Dr. Gerald B. Kieschnick, current President of the LCMS, District President Herbert Mueller Jr., Seminary Professor Dr. Carl C. Fickenscher II, and Seminary Professor Dr. Daniel L. Gard. Due to fair use considerations, only Rev. Harrison’s and President Kieschnick’s responses are presented. Here are the questions asked and these two men’s responses, which in many ways are a study in contrasts:

 

Q: How would you judge the health of The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod today?:

Harrison: This is the most dynamic moment in history to be part of the LCMS! Worldwide opportunities abound. I’m giddy with hope (Rom. 15:4-13)! Yet, we are accomplishing a fraction of what’s possible. The New Testament shows us the twofold reality: “Saints” are also sinners, beset with problems (1 Cor. 1:2, 10ff.). It’s never been different. We need Jesus. We are blessed to know the Gospel in all its fullness. We have faithful workers, the two greatest Lutheran seminaries in the world, LLL, LWML, LCEF, great schools, partner churches—the list goes on! Best of all, the world is open for the mission of Christ. Healthy? Under the Law, no (Rom. 3:9ff.). But by the Gospel, we are congregations of living saints, blessed for this moment (Zech. 8:13; 1 Peter 2:9-10). The key to exploding upon the world in mission and mercy is this: Courage through repentance and renewal by the mighty Word of God. We’re no more or less healthy than that ragtag dozen who burst onto the world after Pentecost.

Kieschnick: A church’s health is measured by its faithfulness to Scripture and the Gospel which gives it birth and to which it is called to witness. The doctrine of forgiveness, life, and salvation in Christ alone is the foundation on which the church stands and the glue that holds it together.

By this standard, the LCMS is a healthy church. Every congregation and church worker is committed to the written Word of God, the Holy Scriptures, as confessed in the Lutheran Confessions.

When viewed, however, by God’s Law, the LCMS falls far short and is sick unto death. Too often the Gospel we are commanded to proclaim is undercut by the witness we give—indifference to sharing it with others, lack of civility and accountability in treating those with whom we disagree, distrust for one another, and failure to confess the full counsel of God in faithfulness to His word.

Thanks be to God for His amazing grace in allowing us poor sinners, in spite of our sin, to serve Him through our beloved Synod, seeking to proclaim Christ’s Gospel in faithfulness and for the salvation of many!

 

Q: In today’s ‘whatever works for you culture,’ how can the LCMS best reach out to people with the Good News of Jesus and testify to the truth of God’s Word?

Harrison: It’s simple—and all in Mark 1. A dozen times the Greek text says “and immediately” Jesus “came,” “healed,” etc. In my favorite verse, Jesus says “Let’s go!…I came to preach” (Mark 1:38). He’s confronted by a leper. “If You will it, I may be clean.” “Having compassion,” Jesus “touched him.” There it is: (1) Jesus acts! Act! Don’t have another meeting! Go! Visit congregation and community. (2) Preach the Good News! We need a revival of Gospel-centered preaching! (3) Have compassion on the hurting—inside the Church and out (James. 2:15ff.). Dare to reach folks where they are (Matt. 25:34ff.). We are blessed with a substantive, biblical message for this insane, post-modern world. “You’re hurting. How’s that ‘whatever works’ thing going for you? You know, Jesus loves you. Here’s how much…”

Kieschnick: Christians often avoid non-Christians. Engaging people, not avoiding them, provides avenues for them to meet Christ. People in every culture seek answers to basic life questions: “Who am I? Where did I come from? Where am I going? Is there a God? Who is He? Does He have a plan for my life? Is there life after death? Is that life for me?” Genuine, caring relationships enable people to feel free to ask such questions in an atmosphere of trust and safety, providing Spirit-led opportunities for sharing God’s answers to those questions from His Word with Christ-centered love, care, and concern.

As God’s representatives, we are privileged and challenged to make known the eternal truths from Holy Scripture, which reveal His grace, mercy, and forgiveness to people who have not yet met Him. We must do so unapologetically, sensitively, boldly, caringly, and courageously.

 

Q: During this year’s convention, delegates will consider proposals to restructure the way the Synod is organized. What is your opinion of the recommendations from the Blue Ribbon Task Force on Synod Structure and Governance?

Harrison: The change we really need is not structural. We lack repentance. (Just look at how we treat one another [Gal. 5:16ff].) And we do not believe that the Word of God can actually unite us (Eph. 3:20). It’s time to resolve enduring issues (http://itistime.org). Part of me might like the massive increase in power proposed for the Synod President. That’s why it’s not a good idea. The power of Synod is only the power of the Word (Walther). There is good cause to celebrate non-geographic districts. Proposals that enjoy overwhelming support should be passed. Narrow decisions will render us more fractured. I am heartsick about the planned elimination of World Relief and Human Care. Change the Lord brings always works for good (Rom. 5:3; 8:28ff.).

Kieschnick: For more than four years task force members have addressed challenges in our Synod—unnecessary bureaucracy, lack of coordination, ambiguous supervisory relationships, inequitable representation, inefficient organization, insufficient accountability, etc. They have sought and responded to feedback from convention delegates and other leaders. While having expressed a few concerns, I believe task force recommendations are critical.

Amended structure and governance will not resolve all our challenges, but will enhance rather than impede the proclamation of the Gospel, improve efficiency, and increase effectiveness. What was first created as an organizational system for a Synod made up of a small number of congregations (14) now struggles to serve more than 6,100 congregations. Task force recommendations are designed to keep our Synod centered in Christ, passionate about accomplishing God’s mission, and devoted to carrying the Gospel which God has given to us with vision and courage into the future.

 

Q: In our present economic environment, money and resources seem tight everywhere. As president, how would you lead the Synod (nationally and locally) in stewarding its resources and people?

Harrison: At LCMS World Relief and Human Care, we’ve been responsible for receiving and managing some $100 million in donor funds over the last decade, always in the black. (1) The Synod has for years borrowed designated funds for operations. This is largely because LCMS World Mission costs (including the Fan into Flame campaign, despite best intentions) have exceeded revenues by millions yearly. It’s time to change how we do business. Synod’s Board of Directors must cease spending in excess of revenues. (2) Since 2001, undesignated funding (from districts) has dropped from $28 million to $18 million. The major cause, I believe, is that we have virtually ceased funding what congregations care most about: (a) Sending pastors to plant churches overseas (Rom. 10:15). (b) Training pastors and church workers (Matt. 9:37ff.). $2 million a year to each seminary can bring 200 international students to our campuses each year! We can rock the world for Christ! (c) Mercy for the needy (2 Cor. 8-9). There is no shortage to what the Lord can provide. The sooner we get back to these basics, (and stop doing some other things), the sooner we will realize it (2 Cor. 9:8). Let’s go!

Kieschnick: Faithful management of God’s gifts necessitates raising the level of Christ-centered biblical stewardship among our people and achieving greater expenditure efficiencies.

Generous contributions for mission support (Fan into Flame) and response to disasters (Katrina and Haiti) demonstrate the willingness of God’s people to respond to spiritual and physical need. Compelling, clear communication about such need is critical, enabling concerned Christians motivated by Christ’s love to respond.

Fewer paid staff can recruit, coordinate, and support volunteers with time, talent, and treasure to offer. Their hearts beat for local, national, and international mission, ministry, and mercy.

With a grateful heart I thank God for women and men who take seriously their role in the body of Christ and support the work of congregations, district, and Synod. I’m overwhelmed by their generosity and dedication!

About Norm Fisher

Norm was raised in the UCC in Connecticut, and like many fell away from the church after high school. With this background he saw it primarily as a service organization. On the miracle of his first child he came back to the church. On moving to Texas a few years later he found a home in Lutheranism when he was invited to a confessional church a half-hour away by our new neighbors.

He is one of those people who found a like mind in computers while in Middle School and has been programming ever since. He's responsible for many websites, including the Book of Concord, LCMSsermons.com, and several other sites.

He has served the church in various positions, including financial secretary, sunday school teacher, elder, PTF board member, and choir member.

More of his work can be found at KNFA.net.

Comments

Contrasting Candidates: Harrison and Kieschnick in The Lutheran Witness — 49 Comments

  1. Bible vs. no bible?

    I mean…our current President’s answers tread very carefully so as to stay within the political bounds of Biblical. What’s fascinating is more that one of the candidates just thought it was a good idea to actually cite the Bible.

  2. Funny thing:
    Harrison told us what we could and should be doing for missions in the world.

    Kieschnick told us to “Get out our checkbooks”.

    [“Clear and compelling communication” does not mean a waste basket of colored brochures expensively constructed by a non lutheran consultant who doesn’t get it!]

    The other reason for decreasing revenues at synodical level is that DP’s have come to consider themselves “little caesars” [OK, not your DP!] 😉 and too much of the congregational contribution clings to their fingers where it should pass through. 🙁

  3. President Kieschnick states “A church’s health is measured by its faithfulness to Scripture and the Gospel which gives it birth and to which it is called to witness.” How is his statement reconciled with his goal to revitalize congregations by using the Transforming Churches Network, which defines health by whether or not your church is growing?

  4. How can a Lutheran Christian even think about “Health” apart from the medicine of immortality, the Sacrament of the Altar, the very body and blood of Christ? The hymns say it well: Christ dwells within me, makes me whole!

  5. I hope every delegate reads these responses. “Harrison: This is the most dynamic moment in history to be part of the LCMS! Worldwide opportunities abound. I’m giddy with hope!”
    Look what might happen: Another 100 million people in the U.S. (‘The Next Hundred million America in 2050’ by Joel Kotkin) Much cheaper energy (‘How Shale Gas is going to Rock the Word, Huge discoveries of natural gas promise to shake up the energy markets and geopolitics’ by Amy Jaffe, Wall Street Journal, 5/10/10).
    There is a breeze behind Harrison’s back. Opportunities! Issues, Ect. on the air ways. People around the world knocking on our doors. I pray this is the Missouri Pentecost!

  6. Just an observation. In response to these questions. Rev. Harrison -12 Scriptural citations. Rev. Keiscknick – 0.

  7. @Scott Diekmann #3

    When you see the word “health” with respect to the church, beware!

    Speaking of TC, perhaps one of these days (say after the Convention) somebody ought to take a look at the Indiana District’s “Revitalization” effort. (Note–that’s not “transformation.” ) It would be a good topic for BJS. No sense muddying the waters before the convention. I don’t think TC is on the agenda there, and the delegates who follow BJS have enough to think about.

    Johannes

  8. For some odd reason I heard Harrison’s quote in a prideful and paternalistic voice:

    “You’re hurting. How’s that ‘whatever works’ thing going for you? You know, Jesus loves you. Here’s how much…”

    I’m sure that Pr Harrison did not use that tone. And I know he’s not a smug jerk. Help!!!

    (I remembered the days before I was a Lutheran. How often I heard the Gospel twisted into a game of one-upmanship against non-Christians. I injured and was injured with hubris.)

  9. From Harrison’s answer to Q2: “Jesus acts! Act! Don’t have another meeting! Go! Visit congregation and community”

    I am humbled how much we need to do this as a church. First, to our members then to the community.

    Let’s focus on God’s word other than burning our money trying to fan the flame.

    Go Harrison Go!

  10. @Scott Diekmann #3
    President Kieschnick states “A church’s health is measured by its faithfulness to Scripture and the Gospel which gives it birth and to which it is called to witness.” How is his statement reconciled with…

    Now, Scott, you’re supposed to believe what the man says, not watch what he does!

    You know, like the card sharper, who keeps up a stream of patter so you don’t notice he’s dealing off the bottom of the deck.

    Or the person who asks you directions in the airport,
    enabling his partner to steal your luggage while you’re being helpful!

  11. I am heartsick about the planned elimination of World Relief and Human Care. Change the Lord brings always works for good (Rom. 5:3; 8:28ff.). –Matt Harrison

    The head that sticks up higher get knocked off first. Especially when its success makes the knocker look bad by comparison.

    The Violet Vatican should beware of killing the goose from which it has stolen golden eggs for its wasteful projects this past decade. The money will NOT keep rolling in.

    There seems to be a state of denial about the reasons money is not pouring into the IC. It’s because of the places it goes from the IC! People are tired of being conned in the name of “mission” when the only obvious “mission” going is to perpetuate the power presently in St Louis while turning our Lutheran church into generic protestantism.

  12. “I am heartsick about the planned elimination of World Relief and Human Care. “

    WHAT?! Which Resolution/Blue Ribbon plan is that ungodly nonsense? To do that is a whole lot of FAIL. I must warn the delegates at my congregation about it.

  13. Hey, hey folks–better read the actual resolutions in Today’s Business. Lots to digest. Delegates have their work cut out for them. How in heck is this process going to happen without mass confusion? There is undoubtedly a plan–I hope we hear about it before the games begin.

    Johannes (concerned)

  14. Carol (#13)

    Proposal 18 of the BRTFSSG, now Resolution 8-08 on page 139 of Today’s Business, wants to elimante all boards and commissions EXCEPT the CTCR, Com on Doctrinal Review, CCM and the Comm on Handbook (formerly structure) and replace the eliminated ones with a Commission for National Mission and a Commission for International Mission.

    So by extentsion the,

    Commission on Ministerial Growth and Support
    Commision on Worship
    Board for Pastoral Education
    Board for University Education
    Board for Black Ministry Services
    Board for Communication Services
    Board for District and Congregational Services
    BOARD FOR HUMAN CARE MINISTRIES
    Board for Mission Services

    will all be eliminated. Unfortunately the Resolution doesn’t specifically state each board, you have to go to the By-Law changes for that. The amount of By-Law changes on this resolution alone is incredible. (See page 142 for the list.)

    And if you look in the Resolved on page 141, line 29 it says,

    “Resolved, That each of these two offices and their staff function under policies developed by two new mission boards: (1) Board for National Mission; and (2) Board for International Mission. These policies will establish boundaries, parameters, and principles that guide the respective mission office in determining present and future activities and programs. The mission boards will have oversight of the implementation of these policies, while the President of the Synod will be responsible for supervising the implementation of mission board policies in accordance with his responsibilities under Constitution Art. XI and Bylaws 3.3.1.1.1–3.3.1.3; and be it further”

    The Boards are advisory only. They are establishing “boundaries, parameters, and principles that guide the respective mission office.” For those familiar with Transforming Congregations Network/Revitalization it is that structure on a grander scale. It is NOT increasing the voice of the congregations, but greatly reducing it, despite the words and bold text of Today’s Business. (See page 133, line 11.)

    Also, the duties and responsibilities of the new Commissions are vague, at best.

    “Resolved, That an Office of National Mission be responsible for coordinating national office ministry that is directed toward or serving domestic ministries and especially congregations and schools through their districts. Such ministries may include but not be limited to Lutheran school ministries and accreditation, human care and domestic mercy efforts, stewardship, evangelism, church planting and revitalization, and youth ministry; and be it further

    Resolved, That an Office of International Mission be established to oversee the work of the LCMS in other countries. This office, among other functions, would place and support foreign missionaries, establish and maintain international schools, coordinate international relief efforts, and support and encourage the work of the Synod’s international partner churches in conjunction with the Office of the President; and be it further

    Resolved, That these offices each have staff reporting to the CMO, who is accountable to the President of the Synod;”

    AND that is only one resolution. It looks like about 14 hours of the first two days of the convention is devoted to this. (To me that doesn’t seem like nearly enough.) AND if this structure change goes through, we will then turnaround and hold elections for the new structure, even though no one has been specifically nominated for either the Board for National Mission or the Board for International Mission.

    I pray my fellow delegates will slog through and attempt to understand the changes proposed. There is so much.

  15. I find it interesting that the COnvention Workbook contained 325 pages and the First Issue of Today’s Businesss contains 325 pages. If they left out so many overtures why are the page numbers the same??? It makes this one delegate wonder what happend to make Today’s Business so big since it was my understanding that it would be similiar to a readers’ digest version of the workbook!!

  16. @Rev. Roger Sterle #17

    Today’s Business includes the Constitution and bylaws with all the proposed changes. Without that Today’s Business would only be 157 pages. Remember, too, that the BRTFSSG Final Report was published as a separate book originally. Some of that material has been brought into the Today’s Business.

  17. @Paul Becker #19

    Exactly. Even if I knew nothing about these resolutions, I’d vote NO on all of them simply because of how they’re being railroaded through: by volume, velocity, and vaguery.

  18. Mr. Becker,

    The thing to understand is that the idea IS bad.

    There have been a lot of words from the President’s Task Force and hierarchy of the Synod explaining that this is a great idea, an urgent need, a huge cost savings, and an important move forward for MISSION. What everyone needs to understand, especially every delegate, is precisely what voting for this resolution, and numerous others, would do.

    Resolution 8-08 would dismantle LCMS World Relief and Human Care and destroy the infrastructure, both human and material, it has built which allow it to shift quickly from domestic work of mercy where there has been flooding or a tornado to international disaster relief, for instance responding to a devastating earthquake in Haiti or Chili.

    Far from creating efficiency, this will require redundancy, creating two separate structures where there is now one, and diminish the ability of the LCMS to respond to human care needs here and throughout the world.

    Delegates need to understand that this is a bad idea, and then vote NO on 8-08.

  19. Perhaps Lutheran World Relief and Human Care can become its own entity apart from LCMS, Inc. like Issues, Etc.. Lutheran World Relief and Human Care in exile.

  20. It’s fun to watch Jesus First push through their (oops, I mean “our”) “Gospel-centered” Transforming Synod Network agenda with reams of…

    Law and bylaws.

    Will the delegates fall for this old game?

  21. Mr. Becker,

    Believe you me, I plan on casting a whole lot of “no” votes along with a “yes” vote for Matt Harrison.

    Similar to what John says, this has been pushed so hard by corporate. And those who oppose it are painted as those who “don’t want change.” (If you’ve ever lived through a TCN consultation you’ve heard is all before.) Pres. K in his charge to FC 8 said (page 22),

    “Change is never easy. Those resistant to change express their concerns in many ways. Fear is a factor in those 8 expressions. Many are reluctant to enter the unknown. Others are concerned about concentration of power. As one 9 who has been called to provide leadership for our Synod these past nine years, I understand these concerns. I also 10 understand and agree with the BRTFSSG consultant who said, “Many opinion leaders, pastors, and others in the 11 LCMS are of the belief that the Synod needs to do nothing in terms of changes in structure and governance. The 12 motivation underlying the desire to leave things as they are is typically rooted in a desire to maintain the LCMS’ 13 core theological beliefs, the fear of change, or discomfort with the alternatives that change might bring. In our 14 opinion, doing nothing is not a realistic alternative.””

    They’ll say “WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING, and this is SOMETHING.”

    I am not reluctant to change, I am reluctant for the WRONG change.

    I’m afraid if the delegates are not familiar with the resolutions and their implications they will say, “They must know. They are the experts.” I had someone at my table at the regional gathering say, “This proposal should pass because they are trying to address the problem.” And this was after I spoke volumes about its shortcomings.

    I also talked to some young pastors at the regional gathering who then said, “Wow, I never considered the implications.”

    I’m optimistic, but cautious.

  22. By CEO/business/$$$ standards, Matthew Harrison has done a measurably better job with WRHC than Kieschnick has done with the Synod.

    Kieschnick likes being CEO, but if he were in the corporate world, he would have–by his own Ablaze yardsticks–have been fired long ago for not delivering.

  23. @Conv. Delegate #24

    “Change is never easy. Those resistant to change express their concerns in many ways. Fear is a factor in those 8 expressions. Many are reluctant to enter the unknown. Others are concerned about concentration of power. As one 9 who has been called to provide leadership for our Synod these past nine years, I understand these concerns. I also 10 understand and agree with the BRTFSSG consultant who said, “Many opinion leaders, pastors, and others in the 11 LCMS are of the belief that the Synod needs to do nothing in terms of changes in structure and governance. The 12 motivation underlying the desire to leave things as they are is typically rooted in a desire to maintain the LCMS’ 13 core theological beliefs, the fear of change, or discomfort with the alternatives that change might bring. In our 14 opinion, doing nothing is not a realistic alternative.””

    (Me)

    This is a pastor speaking? It’s the standard templated change management lecture given in secular multi-national corporations, spoken in the passive-aggressive style of corporations. Key red flag words: change, resistant, express, concerns, fear, reluctant, understand, typically, in our opinion.

    Ack.

  24. @Conv. Delegate #24
    Does not anyone find is typical of the President to quote those portions of a consultation report that seem to be favorable toward his approach and not those which simple state: DON”T DO THIS!!!

  25. And what is the matter with a little healthy fear?

    Like in “We should fear, love, and trust…”

    Fear is not necessarily a negative. I expect that those who spatter others with the fear smear have a few fears of their own.

    Johannes (fearful)

  26. I wonder if Rev. Harrison’s “.” key isn’t working as it should… he sure likes the “!” (13:2 for those keeping track). I have a spare keyboard if needed.

  27. @Rev. Matthew Lorfield #29

    Maybe the Witless editor should have exercised a little more of his editorial prerogative when it comes to editing Harrison’s punctuation. 🙂

    To the gallows, I say!! (Ooops! Did it myself!!) :]

  28. @wrl #26
    This is a pastor speaking? It’s the standard templated change management lecture given in secular multi-national corporations, spoken in the passive-aggressive style of corporations.

    Would you believe some go to be “pastors” so that they can be bureaucrats in a field they think they can succeed in? See #25!

  29. @Joe #30
    And brackets! Square []! and round ()!

    I hope you guys are kidding!
    The only square bracket I saw was one around a Scripture link which occurred inside a parenthetical remark.
    The parens are around Scripture links which is only an “excessive use” if you think he can use too much Scripture.

    Yes, this restructuring would destroy Human Care!
    [“How do we get rid of this embarrassing mountain of “designated gift” debt to an RSO?”
    Simple. Kill off the RSO and trust people to forget where their last “designated gift” really went.]

    If this succeeds, World Relief and Human Care really needs to be the next “Issue”….

  30. John #21 – How, exactly, would the proposals destroy the infrastructure and render WRHC unable to work in disasters, foreign or domestic?

  31. Kieschnick: “Christians often avoid non-Christians.”He seems to be using that statement to argue that because Christians isolate themselves from non-Christians, they therefore aren’t able to witness.

    What would be the basis for such a statement? It’s hardly my experience of that of the Christians I know (usually the complaints go in the opposite direction: we spend all of our time with non-Christians, the question is how do we find Christian fellowship outside of Sunday morning). Does anyone believe this is true, or am I the one off base here? Are most Christians, or specifically LCMS members, really isolating themselves from the rest of the world?

    In the following paragraph he seems to be saying that we don’t make enough of opportunities to witness, that’s an argument I can understand, but not the premise that Christians avoid non-Christians in the first place. The significance to me is how such a (flawed) premise would affect one’s view of evangelism and vocation.

  32. @Stv #37
    Good questions and points. It all comes down to who does the saving. This “it’s all up to you” Jesus-fied Dale Carnegie self-help mentality of American Evangelical Protestantism has infected the LCMS (largely in the form of Ablaze). I seem to recall this guy named Marty who said that God doesn’t need us for anything. The Cross and empty tomb of universal justification has taken a back seat. Word and Sacrment of individual justification has taken a back seat. It’s now largely about the god of “look at me.”

    God help us, and may He grant us a return to historic Lutheranism.

  33. @Stv #37

    > What would be the basis for such a statement?

    I don’t know about this specific case, but a common pattern with the political left is to take its own guilt and project it on to others.

  34. @mbw #39
    I don’t know about this specific case, but a common pattern with the political left is to take its own guilt and project it on to others.

    I was going to suggest that the Rev Dr SP probably didn’t meet too many non Christians where he works… but on second thought, Ablaze sent us a fund raiser who thought he was bound for heaven, “because he’d been a pretty good person”…

    And then there are the Marriotts, too.

  35. helen :
    @Joe #30
    And brackets! Square []! and round ()!
    I hope you guys are kidding!
    The only square bracket I saw was one around a Scripture link which occurred inside a parenthetical remark.

    No preview button here [hint, hint], don’t know if the quoted stuff worked…

    Yes! We’re kidding! Sort of, lions and tigers and bears, oh my!

    Seriously, just a silly post (mine) responding to another one. I’m MH all the way.

  36. Pastor Rossow-
    Does it do away with WRHC or just the board in its current form?

  37. The Lutheran Witness came today, on page 10 it says,

    ” Some functions and programs that the Synod had provided — such as family, HUMAN-CARE, and North American missions — would be transferred to district officesI . Where coordination is advisable, that coordination could remain in the national office.”

    Sounds to me like domestic human care is jettisoned. I wish I had been aware of this at the regional gatherings. THIS NEEDS TO BE QUESTIONED IN HOUSTON. I cannot believe that is the “will of the congregations.” And from what Matt Harrison says, Synod Inc. depends on the cash flow from WR-HC, I don’t know why they’d want to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

    Nothing about the changed structure is clear. There are all these non-specific words describing the new structure like “some,” “may include but not be limited to,” “among other functions.”

    Who knows what the new structure will look like, certainly not the delegates.

  38. @Conv. Delegate #43
    Who knows what the new structure will look like, certainly not the delegates.

    To accept any of this restructuring is to buy a “miracle cure” from an accomplished snake oil salesman!

    Re: designated gifts to WR-HC spent on consultants (who aren’t listened to) and on living well…

    Isaiah 10:1-3 (New King James Version)

    1 “Woe to those who decree unrighteous decrees,
    Who write misfortune,
    Which they have prescribed
    2 To rob the needy of justice, Oakland Calif.
    And to take what is right from the poor of My people, Haiti, Asia
    That widows may be their prey,
    And that they may rob the fatherless.

    3 What will you do in the day of punishment,
    And in the desolation which will come from afar?
    To whom will you flee for help?
    And where will you leave your glory?

  39. @Conv. Delegate #43
    I don’t know why they’d want to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

    Easy! To send Matt Harrison after Wallace Schultz, and numerous others who were so rude as to point out an error of the SP’s. PT McCain also presided over a goose he made to lay golden eggs… but they were Lutheran, so he was opposed/deposed as head of CPH.
    The Lutheran quality, (and the gold, I daresay), is diminishing since.

    Also, as I said elsewhere, to “deep six” an embarrassing pile of debt to HC, which will never be repaid. (In that, there is collusion with the BOD and officers of synod, IMHO. This is way more than temporary borrowing to survive the summer slump, to be repaid by Christmas. This is theft.)

    My opinions are my own and no one else (except the subjects under discussion) is responsible for them (or me).

  40. Rev. Matthew Lorfeld :
    I wonder if Rev. Harrison’s “.” key isn’t working as it should… he sure likes the “!” (13:2 for those keeping track). I have a spare keyboard if needed.

    That! Was! A! Very! Petty! Remark! Can’t! You! Do! Better!

  41. question:
    if WRHC is dissolved in its present form, does that mean the Synod’s debt to WRHC is dissolved likewise?

  42. If WRHC is “dissolved in its present form” who are they going to pay it to?

    All the decision making, and all the power over synodical money, will descend on the man who created that debt by spending millions on consultants to lead the lcms away from Lutheranism!

    [I have taken my own advice and deleted the secular comparison!]

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Notify me of followup comments via e-mail. You can also subscribe without commenting.