Steadfast in Education – The Classical and Lutheran Educator

May 21st, 2012 Post by

Author’s note: This post begins a series that describes those things necessary for classical and Lutheran education. Many confessional Lutherans, including me, see a strong commitment to Lutheran education with a classical pedagogy as part of our identity as confessional Lutherans. Since we are at the very beginning of our move to reclaim this part of our heritage, we would do well to understand what we are reclaiming for ourselves and for the church.

About this time last year, I knew that I was headed to Cheyenne, Wyoming, and that my congregation had a school. Shortly after I arrived, I got a crash course on classical and Lutheran education — just enough to prepare me to teach theology for a year. Now, nearly eleven months after I arrived, I am in the process of writing curriculum for theology and assisting our principal in improving our curriculum across the board. To say I arrived knowing nothing would likely be an understatement, but one thing I’ve learned so far over and over is that classical education must begin with the classical educator.

It sounds simplistic, but consider the analog of the Lutheran Confessions. The Confessions may well be the true exposition of Holy Scripture, but if no one is actually confessing them then they are completely impotent and meaningless. Likewise, the US Constitution doesn’t enforce or defend itself; it requires a government composed of servants willing to enforce and defend it. The classical approach to education works in much the same way.

Classical education is a highly ideological endeavor. It requires that everyone involved be committed to this approach and be educated enough to understand whether a particular pedagogy, curriculum, or worldview works well within this approach or not. It requires that the educator be quite intentional about this ideology and constantly reviewing himself against those high standards.

On February 3, the Consortium for Classical and Lutheran Education (CCLE) published “Marks of a Classical and Lutheran Educator.” This set of standards gives Lutheran classical schools clear goals to develop current teachers and evaluate future candidates . The aforementioned document gives the list of standards in full, but here are a few of the more important ones:

1.     The educator is a committed servant of the Word who lives, confesses, and teaches the Gospel of Jesus Christ in accord with the inspired sacred Scriptures and the confessional writings of the Evangelical Lutheran Church. He exhibits an understanding of Christian Vocation, Baptism, Catechesis, Christology, Law and Gospel, Christian Liberty, and the Two Kingdoms allowing them to shape his thinking and practice.

2.     The educator demonstrates an understanding of and commitment to a classical approach to curriculum and instruction within a confessional, Lutheran framework.

3.     The educator demonstrates an understanding of and commitment to the effective administration of his responsibilities.

Take the time to read the whole thing, and when you do make sure to note well how a confessionally Lutheran worldview is central to the success of a classical and Lutheran educator.






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  1. Marie
    May 21st, 2012 at 13:09 | #1

    Thank you for this post! We are currently researching what eduction option will be the best for our three young boys. This is my first introduction to the CCLE and I am looking forward to exploring their website and resources further.

  2. Dutch
    May 21st, 2012 at 13:56 | #2

    What of bullying?! We are to set the bar, not follow behind it, what of bullying?! Confessional Lutheran adults, know full well, they will be.

    But what of that?! Pray tell?!

  3. helen
    May 21st, 2012 at 14:15 | #3

    @Dutch #2
    What of bullying?

    Do you expect them to be bullies, Dutch, or to be bullied?

  4. Dutch
    May 21st, 2012 at 15:02 | #4

    Helen,
    No, I’ve held my kids while they cried, & were too sick or scared to go to school. A Lutheran School.

    Ya know I luv ya ta bits, but to play w/what I asked. Confessionals, teach their kids, in their home, & that follows them, outside it!

    Helen, think b4 ya post! These are lambs, ya speak on !!!!

  5. May 21st, 2012 at 15:25 | #5

    @Dutch #2

    I would think that part of holding to a thoroughly confessional Lutheran worldview would be the recognition that the teacher is to prevent students from harming one another — whether physically or verbally — out of love for the neighbor. But this problem is no more endemic to Lutheran schools as private schools in general. In fact, as private schools we have somewhat greater freedom to impose discipline than most public schools. Certainly that’s the case in Cheyenne.

  6. Dutch
    May 21st, 2012 at 16:17 | #6

    Pastor Hinton #5,
    Well, ya ya’d think, but it don’t. It just doesn’t in some. And as WELS & LCMS relagate, that responsibility of uniformity, back to the Congregational Council, & rarely are there many who are willing to speak out & up….nope. It don’t change much….a few schools still have teachers, that taught my husband & cousins…& taught their kids…until they all pulled them.

    I want to be supportive & defend Lutheran Ed, but being a Public School kid, who had to & knew the staff & AdMin had to abide by & do better than…at the very least, Confessional & Classical. If Elders pull theirs, someone should want to know why!

    Really?!!!! This is so hard & such fodder for discussion?! No, this is part of the basics from Pulpit..& if that & they do there’s….that & those kids’ homes. Or…if ya choose, whomever gifts a Teaching Degree thru WELS or LCMS.

    My Mum didn’t send us, (’57 Grad) because of her & my Godmother’s experience…me thinks, the more time goes by, the less things that really should…..never change. I wouldn’t know, I was a Public school kid, who learned alot more about what was right, good, & true, than the kids that WELS & LCMS, passed on. Now, sir, they are teaching my sons.
    When did we, as Christian’s who ran Schools, stop being His examples & gave up on setting His bar? Why support something that follows behind everything the world, already has been taught,
    was already wrong?!

  7. #4 Kitty
    May 21st, 2012 at 16:58 | #7

    @Dutch #4

    No, I’ve held my kids while they cried, & were too sick or scared to go to school. A Lutheran School.

    Very sorry to hear about your lambs Dutch. We pulled our son out of Sunday school for the same reason. And he finished junior/high school at the public school. Fortunately, the public school is first rate in many categories. He received an awesome education; (31 ACT), music scholarship to Concordia, 2nd place state speech, etc.,.
    But… he doesn’t know Latin. Why is this dead language so important?

  8. May 21st, 2012 at 17:08 | #8

    Dutch with your knowledge and experience you know what you have to do but are afraid to act. You have to pull the kids out. You cannot change the system! I had to pull my kids for the same reasons! been there done that. Make sure the new school has a good handle on bullying. You will have to find out from the parents of the children that attend the perspective school. Some times public schools are superior to the private schools in a given area. If you cannot find good schools in your area move. I did. Your children are your only concern! This will not be easy! Good luck you will find no consolation here. No offence intended. You at BJS cannot change a school.

    In Christ

    Mark

  9. May 21st, 2012 at 17:12 | #9

    #4 Kitty :
    @Dutch #4

    No, I’ve held my kids while they cried, & were too sick or scared to go to school. A Lutheran School.

    Very sorry to hear about your lambs Dutch. We pulled our son out of Sunday school for the same reason. And he finished junior/high school at the public school. Fortunately, the public school is first rate in many categories. He received an awesome education; (31 ACT), music scholarship to Concordia, 2nd place state speech, etc.,.
    But… he doesn’t know Latin. Why is this dead language so important?

    It can be done!

  10. May 21st, 2012 at 17:15 | #10

    I put something on BJS good luck you will need it!

    My children graduated from a small mountain public school.

    Both graduated with honors from college. It can be done!

    The boy works for the government of Japan, fluent in three languages.

    The girl is a Geologist for the state of Tennessee.

  11. Dutch
    May 21st, 2012 at 17:20 | #11

    Folks, let’s try & at a point put this in some sort of perspective.

    The RC Church in US, has filed legal suit. Against what many have spoken out against. Many parents & said issue of bullying (just try & make that right or ok in the LCMS or WELS schools & ask for support..) & now, the ULC. Really?! Let’s make right, in His House. I said no, as a P.S.G., because it was & at first blush & until we left our 1st…to be the best & brighest. It was as it was to be, we had no idea, not all are, nor are anywhere near, anything neither ELS, WELS, or MidWest LCMS would ever own up to. So…Congregations & members should support, defend, & send …..why?!

  12. Richard Lewer
    May 21st, 2012 at 17:55 | #12

    On the topic of classical education, I have trouble understanding why the language of Latin is essential to teaching confessional doctrine and demanding quality in teaching and learning. I took 3 years of Latin in the old prep school system.

  13. May 21st, 2012 at 18:07 | #13

    Commenters, can we please get back to the subject matter of the original article by Pr. Hinton? Bullying may be a good suggestion for Pr. Hinton in the future for another article, but this one is not about that.

  14. Marie
    May 21st, 2012 at 18:13 | #14

    What I enjoyed about this article was it discussed classical Lutheran education as a way of teaching – not as a specific type of school (public, private, homeschool). It is nice for all parents to have access to this type of information no matter what type of schooling they choose for their children. I know we are always looking for ways to improve how we are teaching Christ in our home.

  15. Richard Lewer
    May 21st, 2012 at 19:05 | #15

    “Marks of …” is an excellent document of what any Lutheran educator should be, but it does not define the uniqueness of what is meant by “classical” education. Are we talking here about the curriculum areas of the Middle Ages that Luther studied under? Is Latin integral to this?

  16. May 21st, 2012 at 19:14 | #16

    @Richard Lewer #15

    I’m glad you brought this up. I began with the classical educator because this is how most will first encounter classical education. The theory underlying the task of the classical and Lutheran educator will be the topic of subsequent posts. As for your two other questions, yes, Luther learned this way (although classical ed is not a curriculum per se) and yes, Latin is integral to this.

  17. May 21st, 2012 at 20:13 | #17

    Pastor Daniel Hinton :
    Latin is integral to this.

    Agreed Latin is important to Lutheran classic education alongside German. I know my son at Luther Prep (WELS) took Latin. Actually all freshmen take Latin for 1 year. He will take 3 years of Latin and 2 years of German if possible prior to college. Perhaps others can speak to why Latin is important. It might be obvious to me and others, but there are some who consider the term ‘dead language’ to mean not worth knowing.

    Good topic here in classic education.

  18. Dave Likeness
    May 21st, 2012 at 21:03 | #18

    “Classical Education” was standard procedure for the
    Concordia prep schools. The LCMS Synodical “System”
    had four years of high school and 2 years of junior college.
    Until the late 1950’s these pre-ministerial students went
    from the junior college directly to the St. Louis Seminary.

    The Concordia Senior College was built to finish the Classical
    education and give the students a bachelor of arts before
    attending either the Springfield or St. Louis Seminary.
    Latin, German, Greek, and Hebrew had all been taught before
    the student entered the seminary. Lutheran Doctrine and
    Biblical survey courses were taught along with a liberal arts
    curriculum. Classical Education gave us well-educated clergy.

  19. Mary Johnson
    May 21st, 2012 at 21:29 | #19

    Latin, although a “dead” language is crtical to a well rounded education. I learned it in high school and have never regretted the experience. It gives a foundation to many languages and sciences. I still use it to this day.

    I was brought up in a Catholic school and loved to hear the mass in Latin. It fostered the desire to understand Greek and Hebrew as I grew older. I went on to study German in college.

    When I learned my pastor had studied the classical languages and realized his abilities I was dumbfounded. Most every minister I knew prior to this (Catholic excluded) barely understood basic theology. I’d ask a minister about some passage in the Hebrew or Greek and I’d get a blank stare. When I ask my LCMS pastor about anything, he’s got the answer, even in the original language.

    I just can’t imagine NOT being trained this way. It’s a framework for success in life, not just a curriculum.

  20. May 21st, 2012 at 23:47 | #20

    @Mary Johnson #19

    I never would have appreciated this before I learned Greek at the seminary, but being able to read classical literature in its original language is a tremendously freeing thing. I mean free in the fullest sense of the word liber, that the one who reads in the original language is free from relying on someone to tell him what it means. So much great literature is available in this language which has formed Western thought for millennia — we do it a great disservice by calling Latin “dead”. We Lutherans can trace our theology through the thought of Luther to Latin-writing fathers, not the least of which is St. Augustine. The liturgy we inherited as Christians of the Western Rite came to us in Latin, though we rightly saw fit to translate it into the vernacular for the benefit of those who could not read or speak Latin. In classical Lutheran schools, students take part in the life of the church through participation in liturgical worship. The Latin tongue is our heritage, and we are bringing our students into this heritage. For example, I will begin tomorrow’s theology class with our upper grades by having students confess what the Western church has confessed for over 1600 years: Credo in unum Deum, Patrem omnipotentem, factorem caeli et terrae…

    As an added benefit, knowledge of the Latin tongue produces a better knowledge and fluency of one’s own language. Inflected languages such as Latin require one to understand how each word functions in the structure of the sentence, and to explain why a form is used in the way it is written. So many English speakers cannot articulate when to use who and when to use whom, or the difference between lay and lie, or even something as seemingly simple as when to use I vs. me. Knowledge of a language that forces the reader to think intentionally about these things (i.e., noun and pronoun case) helps him to use language more precisely. In addition, Wheelock claims that about 60% of English vocabulary is based upon Latin words. Knowledge of Latin vocabulary will help English speakers to decipher new vocabulary words as well as understand the minute differences in meaning between synonyms. I never studied Latin in school, but I am beginning to see the benefits of teaching it to our children.

  21. The PPPadre
    May 22nd, 2012 at 00:01 | #21

    Classical education teaches a way of thinking. As a product of public schools, I did not start thinking in grammar terms until I took Latin.

    Unless you are doing a Rosetta Stone type curriculum, foreign language is still taught in a Classical style. So A foreign language is integral. Now the question of which language? Classical education deals with a lot of texts originally written in Latin, so it makes sense that Latin would be the language that is first learnt (to use my favorite British form of the perfect participle that peppered my Oxford Latin textbooks). Latin is foundational to intellectual thought in Western Civilization. Education in western thought without Latin is like a Christian theological education without Greek and Hebrew. It is possible to do successfully, but it will always have less potential than it could/should have.

  22. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 08:35 | #22

    Pastor Scheer #13,
    Classical Education, 3 R’s, Latin & etc. are not done in public, & rarely, in LCMS or WELS Elementary Schools. It’s why we chose, one well & one poorly, for our boys. Members trust & believe what they are told, when they inquire.

    However, it is timely & the most kind & loving thing, to discuss this & the lack of IEP’s in both our schools. There are Confessional Lutheran parents, who may have “special needs” kids, Confessional Lutheran Education, must have a point of view or ad.min. for these kids. IEP’s are administered, to most kids who present, when screened, for Kindergarten.

    Do the Concordia’s & WELS Universities, have this as basic practice, in their classes? These loving & lovely kids, most certainly, should be viewed, as welcomed, let alone an asset, to choosing Lutheran Education/Classical Confessional Education.

    But most don’t, why?! Why are IEP’s rare or non existant? Some kids, w/special needs excel, with what has been discussed in these posts. I know, I am a parent of one. I wanted to opt for public, but was glad, we found that school the boys went to. I, as a public school kid, thought Lutheran schools, were like that. No they aren’t & many choose not to be. If Christ Himself, welcomed & made the point for us, please explain why special needs Elementary screening & training, & the issues (bullying) are not a priority? They should be, it was taught by Him, pick a NT Gospel. It is relavent, they should be counted for Classical Confessional Lutheran Education. We chose, we won, & then we lost.

    How is this not relavent?! Are Lutheran, Confessional Lutheran parents, to be relagated, to public, for Learning Disabilities or Physical Disabilites, that may or may not present prior to enrollment? Why are parents, to to look to Public, if anything presents itself, rather than our Synods & those the train to teach, do better than & bigger than, the secular world?!

  23. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 09:17 | #23

    Mark for all your posts,
    If we who post here, at BJS, for the gambit of issues, for as long as we have, why can’t we or are we not willing to address any of this?! If we pull kids, what does that say & what are we really teaching & saying?!
    Thanks Mark, kudos & His Pax! No parent should ever be forced to public, for lacking in what Christ taught us & did, with any Lutheran child!

  24. May 22nd, 2012 at 09:34 | #24

    @Dutch #22
    Dutch, I would suggest asking Pr. Hinton to address those questions in a future post. That is why he is writing here, to over time address many things having to do with Lutheran education.

  25. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 09:57 | #25

    Pastor Scheer #24,
    Ya know I respect ya more than I can say. Before we ever, Confessional or other, choose to discuss what is taught, we should discuss, who is able & allowed to attend, any Lutheran School. Special needs, whatever they may be, as any other Lutheran student, are relavent. We discuss subjects, & relagate, special needs, to another discussion? Christ Himself, made the point of choosing, those who were, outside the norm. That is what Confessionals, are now. So are all our kids, adults, and all His kids. We set the bar, not follow behind & ask for a discussion, that never seems to occur, let alone any action taken.

    Subjects taught, don’t deal with many of the reasons, many Confessional Lutheran parent, are FORCED to choose not to support nor enroll their kids, in Classical/Confessional Lutheran Education.

    We Confessional Lutherans, are chided, for a lack of empathy, sympathy, compassion, & mission. We all hear it, read it, when certain posts here at BJS, are commented on. No, Confessional Lutherans are & do, more than is ever visible. This post was about Classical Ed w/in Lutheran schools. Any Lutheran child, should be thought of, & worthy of comment, when concerning, Classical Lutheran Education. Their parents, most certainly do.

    I do pray, w/all my heart, most here, never have to know anything that we parents, deal w/on a daily basis. But LSS, does & are called in, for a reason. If my little girl, has to sit in a chair, & cannot speak, she should be welcomed at an LCMS/WELS school, for a Classical Lutheran Education. If my son, has dyslexia, he should be welcomed, so much more, than any public school could, for a Confessional Lutheran child. If my daughter, has Asperger’s, she should be welcomed, to any Lutheran school, for the Classical Confessional Lutheran Education, they all know, receive, & hear both at home & from the Pulpit.

    Teaching practices & subjects, are the dust bunnies in the corners, of the Lutheran Educational Room. I have, been, & done, as so many other parents have. I am a Confessional Lutheran, my children are taught those at home, and this is relavent, it is proper, it is the everday, for more C. L. parents, than we realize.

    Many kids, are forced to attend public, for these issues, while their Confessional Lutheran parents & all else, exlude this issue, from the Confessional/Classic Lutheran Education discussion. Pastor Scheer, that article was posted, it was responded to, by more than myself. I & many who watch this thread, would prefer that the author, respond. Not privately email. We ask that of those who disagree w/much here, but this, no. Not w/this. Far too many, non Lutherans, are watching on FB, etc. No let the author who posted the article, respond to those parents, who had to choose public, over Lutheran Education.

  26. Niemand Wichtig
    May 22nd, 2012 at 11:58 | #26

    @Dutch #25

    It’s not a matter of people not wanting to discuss the issues. It’s a matter of it not being pertinent to the original post.

    Perhaps, we could find a Lutheran educator, or Pastor Hinton, to discuss the important topic of
    “special needs” kids and learning disabilities.

  27. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 12:15 | #27

    Mr. Wichtig,
    Are Lutheran parents, encouraged & Congregations, encouraged, to support Lutheran Education? Not with standing, Classical?

    Exactly to whom, are we attempting to educate & who is included?

  28. May 22nd, 2012 at 12:39 | #28

    @Dutch #22

    You raise a number of great questions that cut to the core of private education in general, to say nothing of classical Lutheran education. First, I am saddened to hear of your bad experience and sorry you had to put up with that. No one should have to go through that.

    Secondly, you have exposed an unfortunate reality that is emblematic of Lutheranism in general, not only in Lutheran education — namely, that what you get varies from place to place. I will say that the classical approach is a distinct minority among Lutheran day schools (though it seems to have far broader acceptance among homeschoolers). This is slowly changing, but many Lutheran day schools adopt much the same progressive approach to education as their public school counterparts, with a little Jesus thrown in as an extra. So what I describe will apply mostly to that distinct minority. If you’d like to see which schools have taken on this approach, this link is about as authoritative a list as you can find. I say with no small sense of pride that all four primary schools in the Wyoming District are now accredited in classical education. There are others all over the country, but we are in the decided minority.

    That said, you raise the issue of IEPs. For the benefit of those reading this who are not educators, the Individualized Education Program is a plan put together for an individual student who has special needs to address his specific needs. These needs in general affect the child’s ability to learn and function in a typical classroom environment. Here I cannot speak for Lutheran schools in general, nor can I speak even for classical Lutheran schools in general, but only for my own. We do welcome and accommodate some children with IEPs, and they are certainly wonderful blessings to our school. But as a small (~150 students) private school, we don’t have the full range of services available to meet the needs of every possible child. In some cases, such as speech therapy, we have a specialist come to us from the public school to work with those students who need that sort of help. State law requires that students who need special services be provided them, even if they attend private schools. These students are able to attend our school with a reasonable amount of accommodation — and we do make every effort to accommodate students with needs within our ability to teach. But in some circumstances where the student’s need exceeds our ability to teach, it may well be best for that student to attend the local public school and receive the kind of specialized education that cannot be provided him in the setting of a private school. That’s neither a failure of the private nor public school, nor of the parent. In some cases, public schools have much more qualified staff and resources available to teach students with greater educational needs.

    I hope this answers your question. I also hope you never feel that your comments are in any way unwanted or unappreciated, but I will be covering many of these aspects of classical Lutheran education in subsequent posts. Pax Christi.

  29. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 12:56 | #29

    Oh thank you Pastor #28,
    Thank you so much, for explaining, that all this, is tied together & you so lovingly did so! I’m thrilled to know so many, have no idea, what you explained or what we prayed for, to enable us to even think, of our kids enjoying Lutheran Education. There are so many parents, who chose not to, many an Educator, who is glad it’s come up, & many a Pastor, who was just waiting, for someone to say something, for the school his congregation supports….if ya welcome them in the door on Sunday, so much the more, on Monday – Friday at school!

    Until we are willing, as you so loving explained, to not have to use or mention the term “unfortunate” regarding our Lutheran children, in regards to our Education, Primary, Elementary, or Secondary, until we commit, to set the bar & not allow one Lutheran parent, to be advised or encouraged, not, to send a child that may be behind, special needs, or have physical~speech or occupational needs, even the thought, of discussing, subject & Classical instruction is rather obtuse.

    For as you so loving posted & in my inept way tried, we know, but we do not do, we advise but do not change, & we speak but refuse to act. Thank you for posting what you did. Pastors, like you, are the reason this public school kid, chose to say no to them, & chose, at times to my regret, to support & send my greatest blessings & my greatest responsibilities, my babies, my boys, to those….. just like you. Please understand, few are like you…Pastor. My boys will read this, as they do, when I post. They will see what ya said & I know they’ll be content, with both of us.
    Thanks bunches Pastor!!!!!

  30. helen
    May 22nd, 2012 at 14:18 | #30

    @Dutch #4
    These are lambs, ya speak on !!!!

    If they are all lambs, why were your kids crying and afraid to go to a Lutheran school?

    [I've been there, BTW, with both public and Lutheran school.]

    But you raised the topic!

    You’ve raised several topics, in fact. Pr. Hinton has a file of ideas!
    FWIW to you, our Lutheran school employs a teacher for special needs children, primarily the autistic, I believe. [You cannot expect Lutheran schools to be equipped for everything, unless, as suggest here, the state provides some special services to all children.]

  31. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 14:27 | #31

    Helen, did ya read, post #28, by the author of the article we’re postin’ for?
    Yes, there is a lacking & a falling below the bar, Pastor Hinton, hinted at at, in his post. I asked the author, to respond to me. He did, in spades.

    We & I wager quite a few parents, are makin’ appointments, for IEP’s. Confessional Lutherans, always endevor, to go thru their school, Congregation, or Lutheran Social Services. Good Luck, if ya aren’t an LCMS educator or Pastor. Parents, can’t.

    Let me state publically, those who I spoke on, let alone my bebe, if ya met them, & many do, would never know. It only is an issue, in the social aspects, at school. We are blest & far too lucky, quite a few Lutheran parents, what we know & enjoy is a hope, wish, dream, & prayer.

    Helen, if ya know, as ya said in your post #30, if ya really, knew, ya wouldn’t have posted as ya did. Ya would have posted as Pastor Hinton did. We all should, all Confessionals should. We all know & understand, what we are publically, accused of…it is untrue! We are loving, caring, empathic, compassionate, have a huge spectrum for all of these and for sympathy. It is not for show, but we will discuss it, when all else fails to move others. Only then, do we ever mention let alone discuss, what we know, do, hear, see, & say. If it makes the Confessional difference, in an echt way, there isn’t much, we won’t do, or say or length, we’ll go to. I know, I learned that, here….at BJS.

  32. helen
    May 22nd, 2012 at 14:40 | #32

    Excuse my typos. I’ve worn out my welcome on edits in #30! :(

    Dutch, I really don’t know what you are running on about with me!
    My kid was bullied by a teacher in public school and by students in a Lutheran school (until I made a remark to one parent as an aside in Adult Bible class). For that, and other reasons, it stopped.
    Lutheran “lambs” trading on the old man’s rank and status did it.
    Are you telling me I wasn’t supposed to say so? You did.

  33. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 14:54 | #33

    Helen, I ain’t running on ya or going on, I asked you to read post # 28.

    It’s his article, his post, talk & ask him, I did. Pastor wrote & answered everything I asked. I’m content. As Confessional Lutheran & as a Confessional Lutheran parent, and as a parent, who’s child may or may not have issues.

    Pastor Hinton’s response, is why we did & will continue to endevor to keep our boys & not change, their Lutheran Education. If that were so, I would be the 1st to oppose one of mine, going away to school, at LPS. I’m not, not why I asked or posed the questions I did. I & my husband support our Congregation’s School, in spite & dispite the major issues, they may have. That in no way, has anything to do, with your post or w/you. Pastor H, answered me & ask Pastor, it’s his article.

    Ask Pastor Hinton, Helen, I did & he answered. Ask him…not me

  34. helen
    May 22nd, 2012 at 15:12 | #34

    @Dutch #33
    Helen, if ya know, as ya said in your post #30, if ya really, knew,
    ya wouldn’t have posted as ya did.

    Dutch,
    I read Pastor Hinton’s #28. I’ve been acquainted with Lutheran schools and even with (mildly) autistic people. I must be more than a little obtuse myself because I still don’t know what I shouldn’t have posted, (in your opinion)!

  35. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 15:23 | #35

    Helen,
    your post tells me everything I need to know, not to answer. Mildly what?
    Ask Pastor Hinton, to explain what I can’t for ya.

    He will, but I’m sure you will have to ask, as I did. He did me, just ask him…what I can’t explain that he can.

  36. May 22nd, 2012 at 17:13 | #36

    @Pastor Daniel Hinton #28
    Pastor Hinton,
    I have taught in Lutheran schools for 12 years and I reject the notion that there are many that throw Jesus in. There may be some, but none that I have seen. My school is not public school with a little Jesus. The school in which I teach is Jesus all day every day in all that we do. That is not to say that all things are perfect or that we have sinless students or faculty for that matter.For that reason Law and Gospel is an integral part of our school.

  37. May 22nd, 2012 at 17:28 | #37

    I have been interested in Classical Education for some time since it first came on my radar from a charter school experience. I student taught in one. Latin, another language to learn, I always wanted to anyway. Three years of German in high school, a childhood full of Arabic and Greek, adding Latin would be great.

    Some Lutheran schools have a comstant in/out with amny students and I am interested in learning the positives and negatives a classical education would have on that.

  38. Dutch
    May 22nd, 2012 at 17:35 | #38

    Andrew, #36 & 37,
    Shoreland HS & Luther Prepatory School, both teach & require Latin, Freshman year. I know quite a few homeschool/Lutheran parents, who go above & beyond to teach Latin, and another language, besides English/Language Arts.

    Andrew, yes, sadly there are quite a few, as was stated. If ya use the P.S. books, because that is what kids who graduate your Lutheran School will see, that is a type of “throwing Him in”, as well as justifing & allowing. If Lutheran Schools, pick a grade or area, are to survive, we need to have a basics & a base line, for them. If Lutheran Churches are like a box of chocolates, so much the more, for all our schools.

  39. May 22nd, 2012 at 21:34 | #39

    Dutch,
    I have no problem with Lutheran schools teaching Latin, I think that it would be a win win. My disagreement is with the implication that non classical Lutheran schools are Jesus lite. That is simply untrue and needs to be addressed. There is no “throwing Him in,” not even a type of it.

  40. Dave Likeness
    May 24th, 2012 at 08:48 | #40

    I am aware of two “Classical” Lutheran High Schools that
    failed in the state of Illinois. One in the Quad-Cities area
    (Davenport, Bettendorf, Rock Island, Moline) and one in
    Peoria. Both had lack of students and lack of financial
    support from the Lutheran community. Is it possible that
    parents did not fully understand “Classical” education?

  41. Dutch
    May 24th, 2012 at 10:53 | #41

    Folks, I think we should, have a set basic standard, as to what parents & Congregations, are told Classical Lutheran Education really is. Define that, & hold accountable as “standard”, then more parents will support it. Many Congregations know less than the parents who do choose this.
    Parents sending there kids, are not the crux, of the issue, defining why a Congregation has or opens a school, is more important & vital. It speaks about that Congregation & as they are part of a Synod, that Synod.

    Congregations, should be told & in no uncertain terms, have the information & accountability issues, that come, with a school, as “mission”. They never make money, if they do, it isn’t much. Quite a few, state & Fed rules of law, come with any school. The Congregation, in the end, is responsible & is held so, by Synods, for the lacking or issues, in that school. And there are far too many to list.

    This former public school kid, has had cause over the years, to wonder if the Congregations who open pre K or K-8, or keep those they have open, do these Congregations really understand the support of such a huge mission, to itself & the community, really understand, supporting Lutheran schools, begins with those who open the doors. Once open, that Congregation, Council, & Board of Education, truthfully understand the endevor & the accountability that goes along with those kids & staff.

    Any school, should in no uncertain terms be viewed by that Congregation as it’s main mission. They should have all info & have access to it, they are responsible, per Synods, for them. The academics, are only a part, not the whole.

  42. May 24th, 2012 at 11:56 | #42

    @Dave Likeness #40

    That’s certainly a distinct possibility, but not the only one. It is important to be able to demonstrate to parents what the model is, how it differs from the prevailing progressive model of education, and how it will benefit the student. Another reality of all private education is that it’s flat-out expensive. Ours is by far the least expensive private school in the city, and the congregation heavily contributes to the operating expenses to make school more affordable for parents. Many families today cannot afford to pay for school when they can send their children to public school for free. In addition, many congregations have neither the facilities not budget to support a school. It’s a sizable commitment, and one that lay beyond the means of many congregations. In our case, we have benefited from a strong local economy and a gifted principal who knows how to introduce our program to the community and explain — in simple and understandable language — the benefit of what we do to prospective parents. As a result, our enrollment has increased substantially and our parents better appreciate what their children are doing.

  43. May 24th, 2012 at 12:05 | #43

    @Dutch #41

    I think what you’re describing is being done, to one extent or another, by two different bodies. Holding schools to these rigorous standards is the job of an accrediting body, and for classical Lutheran schools it’s CCLE. That’s why I link there so frequently. I can say with some experience — their standards are quite rigorous.

    As for the other, there ought to be either a person or committee within the district to help congregations struggling with supporting a school. Even if they can’t commit actual money, they may be able to help with budgets and the relationship between church and school. No matter how good the school, if the congregation isn’t interested in helping the school is in dire trouble. As you rightly point out, schools don’t make money, and they require the congregation to see the school as their primary mission.

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